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5:52 am
Camera Owner
Kickstarter Backer
April 23, 2012
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Dear Joe & Elle,
Discussions are hotting up on here and over at DVXuser, August is 14 days away and I really think we need a reassuring update on the progress of the D16 Camera & Software.
Myself and others are noticing there are comments and discussions from you both over on the twitter feed regarding Stickers, Colouring books and Dvd's / Blu Ray's but no camera ?
Secondly, Joe I noticed your twitter slogan 'Gainfully unemployed and happy 
' doesn't install alot of confidence, I thought you and Elle where both now employed by your camera company we funded to build us cameras ? http://twitter.com/theycallmejoe
'Silence is not golden' in this respect, please send us an update with good news or delays so we know what to expect and don't start arranging camera shoots for August.
As previously mentioned this is the camera I want, I just need to know when.
7:58 am
March 27, 2012
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I have a feeling Joe and Elle are in the same boat we are at this point. Waiting to see what comes out of the oven.
Hopefully the finished production prototype is not too far out.
8:17 am
July 18, 2012
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Note - I'm also a backer, but my badge is in the mail...
I think all of this can be summed up by the fact that the target for the camera is August...not August 1st.
If you think it's being overnighted to you on July 31, then I would advise you to not wait up.
I will also point out that its nearing the end of July and Black Magic Design is most likely not hitting their date, or will only ship a handful before the month ends to fulfill their pledge.
Does that count? I don't know...When the GH2 came out people couldn't get it in the states for up to 6 months after the initial "release" and this was a large company with massive factories.
RED also has huge problems hitting dates and prices it would seem, if they even do it at all.
I had people in college going on about the SCARLET when I arrived, when I graduated...we all know the story.
But, we are in luck, as by only making 100 initial cameras, Joe and Elle, and the people MAKING the cameras haven't bitten off more than they can chew.
Should they have waited till they were all made then sold them?
It doesn't work like that.
If you've been paying attention, Joe said that the Kickstarter campaign was an article of faith to the guys in Canada making this as well themselves to prove the market and get start up funding.
WIthout the seed money, we wouldn't be getting anything.
If you wanted a guarantee, why chip in now? Why not sit back and wait and criticize like the wankjobs on DVX and so forth, who literally don't know what they're talking about half the time.
It will go retail at some point, but I assume those won't be massive quantities either.
So, like most boutique items, there will be a wait.
But this is basically a camera for people who know what they want/or what they are doing.
The Ikonoskop, basically the only thing comparable now, has made how many units? There's barely any in the states and it costs 5x more, especially if you aren't paid in EUROS.
All of this said, there are no guarantees at life, especially when it comes to buying things online from strangers.
The whole point of the badge Elle is handing out is to showcase those who BELIEVE in this project, not go on forums tapping their foot. Don't sully the status with your negativity.
I mean, if you get this tomorrow, what're you gonna do with it? CinemaDNG workflow is a joke right now anyway. The Bolex software surely isn't going to be released right now anyway.
I don't have time to dick around with nonsensical workflows, RAW is the future, but nobody else is there yet.
Joe & Elle are almost too ahead of the curve here. But I do enjoy the reward of paying a little less for waiting, knowing deep down I made the right choice.
------------
This camera is for people who want to make art, not doodle around with pixel peeping and focus charts.
PS
If Joe and/or Elle are reading this, please ship the camera on or after September 1st, for the rest of us.
11:12 am
June 22, 2012
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1st: This is venture capital, don't forget. It might be lost.
2nd: After some research, I believe that is was extremly good that Kickstarter raised enough money also for the software, since all the software presently available seems sub-optimal. This may delay the release, however (not of the D16, but what will you do without a decent software?).
3rd: Better late than bad.
4th: From what I heared I reckoned (not sure though) that the hardware company behind that, Ienso, will also invest money, if need be. So, I don't think that the project will become a total fail.
5th: We Europeans are in a worse situation.
12:19 pm
March 27, 2012
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As I mentioned on DVXuser, this is not hipster filmmakers building a camera in the garage. It is an international partnership with companies that do have the expertise and engineering chops to make it work, both software and hardware.
Lets not forget that Bolex SA is seriously involved too. Their brand name and reputation is on the line. For Bolex this is a major opportunity to carry their unique heritage forward into the digital age instead of fading into history.
Joe and Elle may be the driving force behind the concept but they have some committed heavyweights supporting them.
12:40 pm
July 18, 2012
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Yeah, reading comprehension doesn't seem high amongst some of the nay-sayers, hence why they seem so confused and in-the-dark.
Razz16mm speaks the gospel.
9:22 pm
July 10, 2012
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I read through some of the db16 thread on dvxuser and I think the criticisms have validity. Kickstarter seems better in theory than in execution overall.. I hope it doesn't prove to be a millstone for DB. I'm sure it's stressful for Elle and Jason to have so many receivables to fulfill by deadlines.
My biggest concern is the project getting shuttered over stupid things, like bad feelings or the complaints of a few. We need this camera!
11:49 pm
April 10, 2012
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Once I learned DB planned their own software, I asked for a 100-frames of video with audio. That way I could write a Guide to using Adobe CinemaDNG tools.
Software can often delay hardware!
Now the lack of any samples -- even a bouncing ball -- bothers me.
3:40 am
March 19, 2012
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One must have a camera before they can shoot samples on it. That just comes back to updates, though. If there's nothing new to report, Joe or Elle should pop onto the board and say they're still waiting for "whatever". I try not to pay too much attention to public opinion, but a lot of people are calling this company a Kickstarter scam for no reason other than a lack of updates.
4:08 am
Camera Owner
Kickstarter Backer
April 23, 2012
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Jade Lane said
Secondly, Joe I noticed your twitter slogan 'Gainfully unemployed and happy
CEO of Digital Bolex; The first affordable Digital Cinema camera!
That's more like it Joe, progress update next please.
5:06 am
March 27, 2012
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DVCinLV said
Once I learned DB planned their own software, I asked for a 100-frames of video with audio. That way I could write a Guide to using Adobe CinemaDNG tools.
Software can often delay hardware!
Now the lack of any samples -- even a bouncing ball -- bothers me.
See my thread on the Ikonoskop samples: they just posted some new ones. It is the same sensor series, just 1080p max.
8:39 am
July 18, 2012
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The hilarious bit is that everyone who is complaining now, will complain when the camera arrives and doesn't meet some "invisible" criteria only they care about, or which doesn't matter in the grander scheme.
For instance, how the Black Magic has 13 stops of latitude instead of the Digital Bolex's lame, weaksauce 12 stops.
This latitude-gap cannot STAND, man.
9:27 am
Camera Owner
Kickstarter Backer
May 8, 2012
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Unfortunately the DVXuser thread has descended from a discussion about the D16, to a trial by mob where Joe and Elle's legitimacy is questioned using logic congruent with that used in the Salem Witch Trials
With BMCuser being the spawn of DVXuser, it should surprise no one that the sentiment is less than balanced toward the D16. Loads of salt should be taken with every post in that thread. I'm happy the people working on the camera are working on the camera and not wasting time responding to bait floated out there by pixel peeping, spec infatuated perennial "shoppers" who are constantly disappointed with every camera's lack of perfection.
9:49 am
March 27, 2012
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The D16 has the two most important features I want in my next camera: 16mm format and Bayer raw recording.
Based on a little play with Ikonoskop DNG files, it will perform more than adequately for my needs at a relatively modest price.
2:22 pm
Camera Owner
Kickstarter Backer
March 18, 2012
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Did the specs for the d16 get finalized? If they did, where might I find them? Because the ones on the specs page aren't the locked down ones that I know of.
1:38 am
Camera Owner
Kickstarter Backer
March 18, 2012
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I just read update # 22 and I have to admit that I am a bit frustrated. At this point I feel it is safe to say that I am going to have to shelf any dreams of using the 16d until it is physically in my hands. August to November is a pretty big leap considering that all the camera backers are going into this blind in terms of post production. I was hoping (expecting) to have a workflow established by the new release date. the only bright side to the delay is maybe there will be time to port pomfort's software to windows by release.
as far as Kish optics is concerned, the lens part of update 22 is embarrassing. The idea (that i bought into) behind the Digital Bolex was to be a creative tool that made the user control the various settings; asa, aperture, and focus.
I honestly cant see myself of any self respecting filmmaker put any money down on a lens that has a fixed stop if i cant change the shutter speed to compensate even more so if there is no aperture priority on the camera. That being said, I really hope this camera doesn't end up with the A priority.
The fixed focus idea is also horrid. There are only two circumstances in which i could see some one using them.
1. A video photo booth company in which the camera and subject are in the same place and the tolerance from the aperture keeps said person's mostly sharp. Joe Rubinstein, you sneaky fella, see what you did there.
2. Interviews, again, both the camera and the subject don't move and are predetermined distances so the interviewee can remain tack.
for the rest of us, if you are focusing using a predetermined focus point then your gonna have a baaaaad time. Yes your shots can be varied, and they will remain in focus, just mostly in focus though. and, if you are determined to have everything tack sharp then get used to having your subject in the exact same place every time. The background will also always be the same, which will either be in focus making it so separation of foreground and background is going to be iffy or its going to be set closer making landscape shots impossible.
and after all that, i will admit that if kish makes a well priced super wide lens, then that will be the lens i buy because the depth of field is so massive, and the price for an adjustable aperture is high enough that id be willing to make the sacrifice.
The hardest part about using the proposed set of lenses will be maintaining originality, if the the aperture the focal length and the focus distance are set then these lenses will work really well for certain shots, and the same shots will get used over and over again. I don't want to be watching another forum member's film and know exactly which lens he she was using because I have done roughly the same and out on production, I dont want to ever use the phrase "hey hand me the; landscape lens, the interview lens, and the two shot lens"
Elle, would you consider putting down your Zeiss CP.2 's or even Switar primes and shooting the next project with Kish fixed focus fixed aperture lenses?
I am sure that most everyone is waiting to see what these lenses are capable of, and if they are practical in the field.
11:54 am
March 19, 2012
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I don't understand why new lenses need to be developed at all, considering the already existing great selection from cheapies to top quality industrial optics for specialized purposes.
Man, the more I learn about single-chip designs currently in the market and in development, the more I think I just need to keep shooting real 16mm, because there isn't going to be an ideal camera for years. This one already has several strikes against it (like all the others, though this one at least has DIFFERENT problems) and I just don't think its many oddities will be overcome by the fact that its only advantages are CCD and C-Mount.
3:48 pm
Camera Owner
February 28, 2012
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Hey Guys,
First thanks for all your input, we read it all and your opinions are important to us and influence our choices.
Hieber and Wado, You are exactly right, there is already a great selection of lenses out there for 16mm, so how do we do something unique and different? One of my history of film professors once said a beautifully shot movie is one with a dozen amazing shots in it, if every shot is amazing it's a music video. I think that goes for unique shots too. Meaning that if you watch a movie and count the number of unique shots vs standard shots(medium, OTS, two shot, establishing) you will find that the number of standard shots far out weighs the unique shots, and that most films shoot with similar depth lenses at roughly the same angle, and roughly the same distance from the subject for a large majority of their shots. This is because we are comfortable with a certain film language at this point that communicates based on these choices. So if we develop lenses that are easy to use, super sharp, and are very cheap you can easily fill your quota for standard shots and concentrate more on your creative coverage. What if you're going to shoot a standard OTS sequence even once in just about every film you make, and I can give you a lens that you already know how to light for and use much faster and easier than any other lens and it gives you the sharpness, and more importantly the color clarity of a $1200 lens for $125? That doesn't sound interesting to you?
I'm not trying to say films are generic, or make everyone's films similar, I'm just trying to say standard coverage is important and probably a good place for us to start concerning lenses. These, hopefully, aren't the only lenses we will make, we have lots of ideas for lenses with moving parts but these will be the cheapest lenses we make probably, and they will give you unprecedented quality for price.
Anyway thanks again for your participation, the forum is becoming more popular so it is taking us a little bit more time to read through it and repond so please be patient with us.
And as always thank you for your support, Joe
7:07 am
Camera Owner
Kickstarter Backer
April 23, 2012
Offline
Hi Joe & Everyone,
I've got to say I am getting concerned about the direction of this all. I spend alot of time reading everyones comments on here and over on DVXuser (which do get rather negative at times) but there is some truth in it all.
Firstly, I expected this update with a delay to the D16 and am not too worried about that, BUT !
Why is there any sort of announcement about lenses or anything else when we don't have anything to go on with the D16 camera ?
We don't have any real footage to look at or grade, This should be the main priority at the moment and would install confidence in the camera backers and stop the negativity out there (as long as it looked good of course!)
Please Joe can you focus on the camera and forget all about the lenses until the camera is close to the final stages, we REALLY need some footage !
When do you realistically think you will have a fully working prototype we can really get our teeth into ?